Duffbert's Random Musings

Comments

1 - I have to tell you, what I really want is not to see a Microsoft booth at Lotusphere (I could care less, actually, but fully agree that IBM has a right to do what they want to control the message at their premier show for Lotus Notes/Domino). I really want to go to a Microsoft show and see what the believers have to say there. Obviously, as Tom has pointed out, we sell a product that supports coexistence between IBM and Microsoft technologies, but being at Lotusphere listening to arguments for Microsoft technologies feels like hanging out at the Democratic National Convention and trying to figure out what the Republican appeal is. If I want to understand theRepublican message, I'd rather go to the Republican National Convention. (OK, to quote Andrew, I'd rather slit my wrists and exsanguinate on the floor, but the comparison is still apt)

So, what is the equivalent Microsoft conference?

Posted by Ben Langhinrichs At 20:19:05 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

2 - Were they created in the managed client, or just displayed in the managed client. When they are all created in the Managed client, then that is progress.

Posted by Carl Tyler At 10:28:43 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

3 - It didn't sound like Gary was going psycho over not having a booth...just genuinely surprised. Having seen him in action at a non-vendor conference, the geek in me believes that the geek in him is having a blast integrating Notes with MS technologies. And geeks love nothing more than to show other geeks what they can do. Yes, his employer would really rather you dump Notes and buy MS. Just like every other business I can think of. If he can't be 'on stage', then top of the escalator works for me.

Posted by Dan Sickles At 22:38:54 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

4 - Hi, Gary... I agree your information is useful. I wonder about the "get Domino 7 servers". Perhaps "upgrading to Domino 7 to better use Web Services" might be more accurate? I can't believe that Microsoft would be convincing people to make initial purchases of Domino servers. And the "Domino servers run on Windows" is irrelevant to my point here. You're not at Lotusphere to sell operating systems. You're there to talk people into using Microsoft collaboration products in addition/in conjunction with Notes/Domino.

And yes, there's emotion there. And even if you don't see MS as trying to "kill Notes", that's not what MS executive management says, nor is it what the MS sales reps tell our senior management. It's really not *you* that's the problem, Gary... It's what everyone around you says and does on the topic of Lotus Notes/Domino. And what they say and do doesn't help your message at all if the message is cooperation and collaboration. The message I hear and see from everyone else around you is migration. Two entirely different things...

And we might just end up meeting at Lotusphere. As I stated in an earlier post, I *do* want to understand more about Microsoft's collaboration products. It sounds like the closest match to Domino's offering is InfoPath and SharePoint. Once I understand that a bit more, I'd like to delve into it a bit.

And no, this doesn't mean that I feel Microsoft has a place at Lotusphere... I don't go there to hear about Microsoft's products...

Posted by Duffbert At 14:20:45 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

5 - Gary, I think your missing the message here. IBM does not want Microsoft at Lotusphere talking about their technologies. They are allowing speakers to talk about topics that include Microsoft technologies (such as my jumpstart and bootcamp session on Office integration). Since this is an IBM conference, they get to decide that. We can debate weither or not IBM should do that, but in the end it is their conference, their decision. Microsoft can (and has) done the same with compeating vendors at their conferences. So while I understand that you want to evangalize .Net integration with Domino, the Notes 2 .NET conference you run with Advisor is the place for that. I just think you are asking for trouble if you sit out in the Dolphin lobby and court people.

Posted by John Head At 14:21:21 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

6 - @Richard why do you think that was the case? See my additional comments at http://www.edbrill.com/ebrill/edbrill.nsf/dx/tom-duffs-not-buying-it

Posted by Ed Brill At 07:17:09 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

7 - It's IBM's party, and they can cry if they want to!

I've been to a fair few Microsoft events recently (read into that what you will - a veteran Lotus Developer with 6+ certifications, most of them Principal/Advanced/Whatever attending Microsoft events), and have never seen an IBM presence. I'd be interested to know if they applied for a booth, and if so what angle it would be taking. I'd guess hardware, but HP seems to be the preferred vendor of choice at the moment, at least it is here anyway.

From the angle of a consultant who works for a business partner, dealing with mixed environments on a regular basis, I'd personally think that a stand which demo'ed some interesting and innovative integration could provide a lot of value to both parties. It's something which any consultant has to deal with these days, and while I can print out Red/White/Purple with pink spotted books until the cows come home, there needs to be something with a 'wow' (no, not World of Warcraft.. sheesh) factor which gets the client interested to start with.

It's no secret that Microsoft has a group of people currently dedicated to the task of converting Domino shops over to Microsoft technology. They're proud of that, they mentioned it quite eagerly at TechEd (and at the moment if they offered me a job I think I'd take it) even though their presenter seemed to lack a grasp of certain Domino concepts. So yes, there's a legitimate concern that the content of a Microsoft booth at LotuSphere could be somewhat counterproductive. However shouldn't sort of an event be about the customer? And if so, wouldn't the customer be interested in seeing demonstrations or information about Microsoft/Lotus integration which they could use in their environment?

I know I would.

/me shrugs, who knows?

Posted by Ross Hawkins At 00:43:20 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

8 - Directly, none. Of course I would suggest that the same can be said of NCT Search -- if you sell my servers as a result of NCT Search, its only because in some way my product allows some fucntionality otherwise difficult or impossible for a potential customer.

I believe, honestly, that vs.net with Domino at the back end, is a compelling way to keep Domino installed at sites which do not wish to use the Notes client.

Posted by Andrew Pollack At 07:31:17 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

9 - My follow-up thoughts:

http://hostit1.connectria.com/twduff/home.nsf/plinks/TDUF-6K45ZY

Posted by Duffbert At 09:52:38 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

10 - I understand how you might feel that way as a business partner. A business partner is going to take a different view of technology than a software developer at company "x". And I'd venture to say there's far more developers and managers from company "x" at Lotusphere than business partners.

And if you get laid off because your company bought the Microsoft "Notes is dead" line and dumped Domino, then it's more than just a software business. Spreading mistruths about your competitor isn't a "software business". Yes, in a perfect world you learn the new skills and move on. But some people don't get that opportunity due to short-sighted management. For them, finding a new job is a bit more personal...

Yes, Gary is doing his job. No problem there. I just don't think that Lotusphere is an appropriate venue for that. Lotusphere is much more technical than it has been in the past (that's good!). But it's still the premier IBM/Lotus marketing event. Giving your competitors space in that venue to tell their story just makes no sense at all.

Posted by Duffbert At 06:16:16 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

11 - @Adam - most IBM presentations will not be done in PowerPoint this year. And I didn't ask about renewals -- I asked about new servers.

Posted by Ed Brill At 06:19:08 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

12 - @ Ed - You're asking the wrong person this question.

Gary's blog only says Microsoft wasn't granted a booth. I'd like to think that IBM did the right thing and gave them parameters in which their participation would be welcome. Based on this thread, I'm beginning to doubt this was the case which is a shame.

Posted by Richard van Geilswyk At 07:09:20 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

13 - The IBM Workplace Managed client will be used instead by the majority of IBM presenters at Lotusphere 2006.

Posted by Ed Brill At 07:07:57 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

14 - Yes, presentations will be created and presented using the managed client.

Yes, it works fine for this.

So, prepare to be surprised :)

Rock

Posted by Rock At 13:38:30 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

15 - I posted this comment on my own blog, but since it seems most are following the mud-wrestling over here...

An interesting case in point: The Detroit Notes User Group this week featured a Microsoft presentation which was billed as "Integrating .NET with Lotus Notes".
Link: http://www.detdominopros.org/hosting/dnp/dnpmeeti.nsf/All%20Meetings/$first!OpenDocument&AutoFramed

Now that you know how it was billed, go read Rob Wunderlich's summary of the meeting:
http://www.dominounplugged.com/hosting/dominounplugged/home.nsf/archive/20051214-1053%20PM?OpenDocument&count=-1#post

Read from here forward: " Many of us may have dismissed Sharepoint as a poor man's WebSphere Portal, yet Gary did a great job of explaining how Microsoft is positioning it. "

Any questions? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trojan_horse

Posted by Ed Brill At 04:53:13 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

16 - LOL... gotta love those still, small voices... :)

Really, from a technical perspective I'm sure his information is valuable to those who need it. From a marketing perspective, his presence there is unwarranted.

And I should clarify a bit... It's not so much Gary's presence, as it is Microsoft's presence with the agenda that Gary verbalized.

Posted by Duffbert At 10:13:40 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

17 - Where would Lotus be without Microsoft? And for that matter this blog

Posted by Bruce Elgort At 18:28:09 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

18 - I absolutely don't agree. I see a big gap opening between IBM Lotus Notes/Domino and Microsoft .NET technology. So why not give them a boot to help us developers to close this gap?

Peter

Posted by Peter Gloor At 08:15:02 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

19 - Those demonstrations, Ross, are available in jumpstart sessions, application development sessions, hands-on labs, and "meet the geeks". From people who are actual practitioners in the field, not just demo dollies. I think the customer value is clearly available.

Posted by Ed Brill At 04:41:30 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

20 - The real beneficiaries of Gary's participation are customers : most of whom do want these environments to work together. Gary doesn't go to bash IBM or Notesn and he displays a great deal of respect for both.

More on this http://cliffreeves.typepad.com/dyermaker/2005/12/lotusphere_2006.html

And yes, IBM is able to exhibit at Microsoft conferences.

Posted by Cliff Reeves At 08:58:22 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

21 - You're right, Carl... personal slings and arrows are uncalled for.

I can't speak to the GS issue. I've never had anything to do with that group.

"Fear"... no fear of having Microsoft there. It's a matter of message. Microsoft showing integration and migration strategies at a Lotus conference is the wrong message. It's the right one for MS, to be sure... :) As John stated earlier, that's what the Advisor "Notes2.Net" conferences are for... emphasis on the "2"...

Posted by Duffbert At 15:43:26 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

22 - It seems very wrong that the #1 OS vendor on which both Notes and Domino are deployed can't have a booth. It's a shame that IBM & Microsoft (or Microsoft and IBM) couldn't come to a consensus on what they would demo/show at LS06.

@ Ed - Microsoft might not further another Domino sale but what about xServer sales? IBM is a big and diversified company.

Posted by Richard van Geilswyk At 04:37:40 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

23 - I sat in a briefing with IBM where all of the presentations were done from the managed client ... within the past 60 days. Never saw a glitch except someone forgetting what button to click to move the slides forward. :) Doubt they will have any trouble at Lotusphere as well.

Posted by John Head At 09:34:42 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

24 - Ed, at Lotusphere. OK. That will be fun to watch them eat their own dogfood. Especially if they have to present and demo.

OpenOffice would probably be easier though. Or Powerpoint.

Posted by Volker Weber At 09:11:25 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

25 - The reality is somewhat more complex than any of this.

Gary left IBM at a time when IBM was (to all outward appearances) as hostile to Notes as Microsoft was. That's not the case any more -- not by a long shot, but that's the snapshot of the time when Gary left IBM.

Ignoring your opinion on Gary's departure, for the time being he has a lot of knowledge that is useful for people working in a mixed environment. That knowledge on the IBM side will tend to get more stale over time, and Gary's role at MS will become more and more tied to the MS product line. Its only natural.

Just give it time and nobody will resent anyone personally any more. There is surely no reason to.

Now, as to MS having a booth at Lotussphere? Well, IBM is clearly within their right to say no. They're definately making more of a statement of strength and direction by doing that this year than in years past, and Microsoft (as a company, not speaking of individuals here) has not historically been terribly "well behaved" at the conference when they've gone as a sponsor.

I honestly have no idea how IBM is represented (or if they are) at MS events. I can easily see them with a booth selling servers (I'd be dissapointed if they weren't there), but I cannot see them using that both to push Domino. Would MS behave that way if they had a booth? I'll bet they'd actually find themselves having to work not to take the bait as customers came by all day to start exactly that conversation.

Floorspace is selling out, from what I hear. Given that, does IBM give a booth to its competitor in the hopes that they'll stick to areas where they work together and not work at co-opting the customer base or does it give the floorspace to more direct partners?

I can't really fault IBM's decision here. What I don't agree with is this negative implication of PEOPLE whom I know to be good people.

Amy and Gary both are good people. They're friends of mine. They're working in new jobs at new places and they'll play their parts as good citizens of the companies they represent. Regardless of who they work for, they're good people. On their behalf -- because there really is no comfortable way for them to say so -- I resent the implication that there is some kind of treachery involved.

Posted by Andrew Pollack At 14:16:33 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

26 - Maybe I'm missing something here, but isn't the purpose of the Product Showcase to showcase products so that attendees might purchase them? Perhaps Gary's forum should be something else, like a BOF, or just sitting in the lobby and talking to customers. I've known other BPs that rent a meeting room or hospitality suite during the week to have customers visit.

As it's been said, IBM's in charge and can do what they want, it's their party (speaking of which, where's the info on Sunday and Wednesday night on the LS site??). If Gary is there to help users and not sell, the showcase isn't where he belongs. Sure, it makes it easy, but I have a feeling that people that want to find him could find him wherever he ends up.

Posted by Ted At 11:28:58 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

27 - Interesting:

> most IBM presentations will not be done in PowerPoint this year

What will be used instead?

I would be very, very surprised to see IBM dump PP quickly enough that MOST presentations won't be PPT in 2006.

Posted by Volker Weber At 06:42:03 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

28 - Duff-

I had similar thoughts about this when I read Gary's entry. In fact, the thought of "about time they told you to take your sorry blue butt back to Redmond" was what I was really thinking. And I agree whole heartedly that, unlike the rest of the vendors, the purpose of Gary's visit to Orlando is to convert as many Notes Developers into .net as he can. I just wonder if there is a Lotus Notes/Domino booth at the .net convention that would allow Ed to do conversions in the opposite direction.

Sean---

Posted by Sean Burgess At 09:45:38 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

29 - No "treachery" intended, Andrew... Gary as an individual working for Microsoft has useful knowledge for those who are in need of integrating the Microsoft and Domino platforms. Gary as an individual working for Microsoft is very involved and into how web services can allow the two platforms to work together. Microsoft as a company sends a very different message.

I don't think we'll come to any agreement or mutual understanding here, as you see "Gary" and I see "Microsoft". I also see you as "technology" and I'm more "technology and message".

And such is life...

Posted by Duffbert At 14:34:49 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

30 - @Andrew - how many more Domino servers will IBM sell through Microsoft's efforts?

Posted by Ed Brill At 07:04:08 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

31 - Duff, this is not war, politics, or religion. Its a software business.

Gary's purpose is to expose Domino developers to the .NET development platform. There's low hanging fruit there in that there is value to be easily added by combining the two platforms.

Gary has, in fact, been helpful to me personally in getting an application developed that is simply inappropriate for me to build at the front end with Notes, but which does quite well as a .NET front end application. I'm using a back end Domino server for this because, frankly, it makes sense. Could an IIS based server do it? Probably. I'm also using an Asterisk server for live communication. Could a Live Communication Server do it? Probably.

I chose the tools I did for good reasons. Gary was able to help as part of his role at Microsoft which is to spread the word about the .Net development platform. I've expressed willingness to take part in a case study based on this. To mis-quote the song, "I used him, he used me, and neither one cared". Why? Because we're both doing our JOBS. He's getting .NET used on a project, and I'm building something with the best tools for the job as near as I can tell.

Are my loyalties divided? First, my loyalties are to my clients. If I'm loyal to Lotus Domino to any extent, it is because it is so frequently the very best product on the market to do the kinds of work I find rewarding and valuable personally, and helpful to my clients.

As far as Lotusphere, I believe currently that one of the most powerful things you can put in place in front of a Domino server where the users touch it, is a custom application built in MS Visual Studio .NET. Its a nice front end platform and it lets you take full advantage of the better security, back end processing, directory, and document management capabilities of the Domino server. Given that, why NOT have them at Lotusphere with a big booth showing off Visual Studio .NET.

The idea that MS will "Steal" partners is just stupid. Good partners will go where the customers pay them, and will advise customers based on the products which will let them create value added applications in a profitable way.

The idea that MS will steal Domino seats with their own collaborative tools is perfectly normal. Competition is good. They'd be foolish to try doing that at Lotusphere, however.

Posted by Andrew Pollack At 06:02:59 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

32 - I give out plenty of useful information and, as best I can tell, no misinformation. I've persuaded many customers to get Domino 7 servers by showing how to use Domino Web Services with MS Office and other Microsoft products. Tons of Domino Servers run on Windows. As far as I know, I've had the first public Domino 7 demo site at www.msdomino.net complete with web services.

The best point here is that folks don't want to see Microsoft at Lotusphere because they see them as trying to kill Notes. This I understand - its emotional - and how I feel when I see an IBM sign

I'm going to hang out near the top of the escalater area in the Dolphin. Feel free to tell me how you feel. Then we can talk about technology

Posted by Gary Devendorf At 13:50:06 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

33 - Thanks for that explanation, Chris... I will admit to being *really* confused last night when I read your post. :)

Posted by Duffbert At 14:08:12 On 16/12/2005 | - Website - |

34 - whoops - of course, I meant:
I think Lotusphere will survive withOUT the MS Booth there.

My eyes were glazed over after reading all these posts!

Chris

Posted by Chris Reckling At 13:27:33 On 16/12/2005 | - Website - |

35 - Wow.
A couple of things popped in my mind while reading this blog (in no particular order):

- DB2 supports .net, why not Domino ?
- If showing Microsoft Products is a problem, why are most IBM presentations done in powerpoint?
- It’s IBM’s show, they get to call
- I’ve recently had customers in front of Gary, some people in the audience would of loved him to say move to exchange, it’s easy. Instead he said something like, upgrade to Domino 7, use web services, get on with it.
- IBM IS going to get more software renewals because of what Gary said.
- It’s only 10 days to Christmas

Posted by Adam Osborne At 03:22:51 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

36 - All I know is that I like Gary, and respect his opinion on things. I've tipped back drinks with Gary on a couple of occassions, and I remember distinctly him talking about moving away from this "thin-client" movement, and what was really needed was a full featured web client.

Years later this is now a reality with the Workplace Managed Client. Gary was way ahead of the curve, and I liked that.

Is it okay for IBM to deny MS a booth? Sure. But if they really weren't afraid of them, they wouldn't care... If IBM was really putting on the boxing gloves, they wouldn't feel intimidated by a booth.

Would MS give IBM the same courtesy at a conference? Not a chance in hell

Now, all of this being said, Will I ever migrate to MS.net, or Sharepoint, or Exchange? Not if I have anything to say about it.

Heh...

-Grey

Posted by Greyhawk68 At 07:22:32 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

37 - @Sean : Gary is no Ed Brill. I mean that in several ways, but most importantly that Gary actually does his best work (IMO) when he uses his knowledge to help people figure out ways to get things done, and at his least best when he tries to do the Ed Brill spin thing. This conversation is a perfect example. If you're honest, I think you'll agree that what bothers you is the condescending manner in which the comment on his blog came across. The joke didn't work. I'll absolutely grant you that. I can't see Ed ever going to an MS show for the same purpose Gary is going to Lotussphere. It makes no sense and would put him in an unwinable position.

If you want to compare apples to apples, IBM could consider sending someone like, say, ROCKY to an MS show to show people what cool stuff they could do with a Domino server on the back end of VS.NET instead of an IIS one. I'm still not sure it would make sense, but the comparison is better.

Posted by Andrew Pollack At 14:25:52 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

38 - I have to say I am in agreement with Andew. 4 years ago, I was lucky enough to do a deal with microsoft where Instant could use the Microsoft booth, as all IBM would allow Microsoft to do was give out Windows Server 2003 Beta CDs. Fortuantely, we were able to show Sametime and Outlook integration, with Microsoft footing the bill, MS were happy as they got an Outlook client on a pedestal at Lotusphere, and IBM was happy as they had Sametime on the Microsoft booth.

I have to say I was dissapointed by many Lotusphere attendess who assumed I was a Microsoft employee, I was given abuse those few days, the likes of which I had not heard since I was in the school playground "Eh what's that smell", to things like "Boy MS employees are as big and as bloated as their apps". Seriously, it was a big eye opener, If Microsoft employees want that abuse let them at it.

IBM is a large organization and there are many conflicting goals. I believe IBM used to be Microsoft's largest Development tool purchaser, no idea if that is still the case.

Here's a question, which company has come to us with more requests to help migrate Sametime users to Microsoft LCS? you'd think Microsoft but in fact you'd be wrong. IBM Global Services, who basically would sell their own children if there was consulting $ in it, have actually come to us more often than Microsoft to help migrate users. I'd worry more about that than Gary at Lotusphere.

I believe Ambuj Goyal said in an interview that was referenced on Ed's site "when Microsoft goes head to head with Lotus, Lotus wins" so what's the fear?

I like to take the moral high ground on these things and imagine that adults are dealing with adults, and adults can be expected to be well behaved and ethical.

Posted by Carl Tyler At 15:29:53 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

39 - yes, i believe they were made i the Managed Client ... and having the Managed Client running myself, I have created presentations in there as well. Remember, the IBM Productivity Tools that come with the Managed Client are based on OpenOffice technology.

Posted by John Head At 14:44:22 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

40 - @Richard - Do you think MS would have been interested in exhibiting if they were restricted to talking about Windows 2003 Server (no SharePoint Services) and Windows XP?

Posted by Ed Brill At 06:17:11 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

41 - @Gary - "This I understand - its emotional - and how I feel when I see an IBM sign "

Gary, you were hired into Notes PM in 1996. IBM already owned Lotus at that point. Your own website (not your blog) says "I enjoy a great relationship with the IBM folks and would be glad to pass on any product feature requests you may have. "

When you write stuff like this, it really hurts your credibility. You may think it helps gain sympathy from people who were "Lotus yellow" and resent IBM taking 100% of the reigns or whatever. But the reality is, without IBM, Notes would in fact be as dead as most of your colleagues in Redmond want it to be.

@Andrew - I have staffed an IBM ped at an MS event once -- July, 2001. I don't think IBM software has exhibited at an MS conference since that era. It would definitely be interesting -- and I'd rather send Rock into the lion's den than me

Posted by Ed Brill At 15:01:27 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

42 - You don't think MS would send all the ex-Loti to populate the booth like last year? I think Lotusphere will survive with MS Booth there.

Hey, maybe Ray will show up, too.

Chris

Posted by Chris Reckling At 19:13:09 On 15/12/2005 | - Website - |

43 - Yikes! Such heat over so little! So IBM denied Microsoft a booth at Lotusphere. Note that they did not deny any Microsoft employee a ticket, they (ok, we, though I had nothing to do with the decision) simply said Microsoft couldn't hang their flag out in public at the showcase.

Gary, Amy, and perhaps others among my many friends and colleagues who currently happen to work at Microsoft will still be at the event. This is good for me, because I get to see them, catch up, maybe trade some tech-talk, maybe hang out.

Sure, Microsoft tries to win people over to its products, and IBM does the same. This is what big software companies do, they compete. It's (part of) their job. That doesn't mean IBM has some obligation to make Microsoft's job easier by letting them have a booth at an IBM event.

And (btw) there will be some Microsoft technologies making an appearance in a couple of my sessions too. Come on by! (Gary, if you're reading, feel free to show up and ask questions. Leave the paper bag at home)

Posted by Bob Balaban At 17:35:46 On 13/12/2005 | - Website - |

44 - Microsoft and IBM are cooperating in the space of webservices specifications. Gary has some interesting examples I discovered not before last week.
Webservices & SOA are in my opinion just one brick in a world with more feasible integration of platforms. There are a lot more. Its just getting easier to integrate Lotus, Java/J2EE, .NET.
In my opinion its just a technological trend, which can't be stopped and nobody is able to stop it, anyway.
I once worked for a Lotus consulting where I tried to promote Java and Websphere, but I hit against a wall. Then I worked for a different company which shows more openness, I did not completly leave Domino programming and have been a black figure on their accounting sheet.
The last german branch of my ex-employer was sold last week to RealRisk Ventures LLC (try google). Does not sound very good, if you ask me.
Result: Openness works for me. With a closed mind, you finally find yourself being sold to the RealRisk LLC folks. Other people might make different experience and its surely not easy.
Among developers there is for sure a trend to get mixed skills and being less sold to 1 platform 100%.

Its lots of work, but doing also Java did make me a better Domino developer in areas like general understanding, object orientation and integration. Lotus might not sell more servers because of that, but it helps my customers.

I am not the person who decides if Gary Devendorf should be allowed to visit Lotussphere or not. Not my business. But the material to interoperability between Domino and .NET is there on the internet, anyway, and MS & IBM are working together on the underlying specs (WS-xxx).

Posted by Axel At 03:04:16 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |

45 - And also remember, that IBM never gave anything back to OpenOffice.

Posted by Volker Weber At 17:26:44 On 14/12/2005 | - Website - |